SHSBC 29

QUESTION AND ANSWER PERIOD: PROCEDURE IN AUDITING

A lecture given on 5 July 1961

Okay. What is this, the fifth of July? Do you realize yesterday - yesterday
was the anniversary of George III's considerable upset.
Female voice: That's sacrilegious.
I did a terribly sacrilegious and irreverent thing, though. I found a
guinea, a golden guinea with George III's head on it. Had it made up in a
tie pin and took his head back to America. Terrible thing. What makes it
doubly funny - what makes it doubly funny is I was, of course, on the other
side of that war. I was an observer on Howe's staff during the Battle of
Bunker Hill. Wasn't even British, but I was there. Yeah.
Well, anyway, I haven't given you a chance to ask any questions for some
time, so how about a question? Gee, I'm glad you know this stuff. Why, I'm
really glad you know it. Yes? -
Female voice: Well, I think it's stupid asking this question, but when
you're doing Goals Assessment.
When you're what?
Female voice: When you're doing a Goals Assessment...
Yes? When you're doing...
Female voice: ... do you cancel out that there is no more question at that
time. I mean really go after it hard...
Hm.
Female voice: ... before you begin nulling them.
Hm.
Female voice: . . . or is it all right just to take the list the preclear
hands you and then start in on that?
Is it all right to do what?
Female voice: Or just to take the list the preclear hands you or the list
you already have...
Hm.
Female voice: ... and start in on that.
No.
Female voice:... I mean you can say to him, "Well, do you have any more
goals?" and if he says, "No," not search for them or you can actually
search for them.
No, if you're not - you don't have an option. Now, the question is, is
"When doing Goals Assessment and you come to the end of your list, should
you ask for more goals or not?" Isn't that what it'd boil down to? Or, "Can
you get away with just going over your list and not asking for more goals?"
Does that add up your question?
Female voice: Not quite, no. I mean should you actively search for more
goals? Actively search?
Should you actually search for more goals? Yes. Well, it's - I think this
is the same thing. Should you ask for more goals? Should you search for
more goals? Yes. This is mandatory. In doing an SOP Goals Assessment, when
you have gone down and finished off the list, you must always search for
more goals in all categories. Not just more goals, but goals by categories.
Antisocial goals, secret goals, hidden goals, goals that you would like to
hide. Any kind of goal that you can think of or goals about health. Any
kind of a goal that you might think this pc still has, you ask for this and
add those to the goals list. And of course, every time the pc gives you a
new goal spontaneously, you also add that to the goals list.
The goals list is a continuing action and it must always be continued. And
as a matter of fact, when you think you finally have the pc's goals, you
don't, unless you get a null on, "Do you have any more goals?" You say
well, I've got the pc's goal, and it continues to fall, but the checkout
might demonstrate that the pc still had more goals. Now, if the pc still
has more goals, the one which you found with such ardor is liable to go
null.
But what is adding auditing time... And I'm awfully glad you asked this
question. It's not a stupid question at all. It's something I should take
up. Here I'm neglecting the piece de resistance and talking about the hors
d'oeuvres all the time in not talking to you more about SOP Goals. Because
it's a pretty precise activity, and if you're going to get anybody Clear,
you're for sure going to get them Clear by running SOP Goals and not by
doing anything else. Therefore, any question with regard to SOP Goals is
very germane. And this is probably the only place in the world right now
you could learn the straight dope on SOP Goals. So it's very far from a bad
question, Evelyn.
All right. Now, let me give you a rundown on this. Should I? Just let me
give you a very squared, cubed, triangular rundown on it that all buttons
up very nicely. You are making a mistake in running SOP Goals Assessments,
which winds up in getting fantastic numbers of goals. And the mistake is
this, and in view of the fact you haven't been told to do it precisely,
therefore, it can't be added up as a mistake. But it's one of these things
you wouldn't think you'd have to tell somebody.
When you get to the end of a goals list... I have a feeling maybe you've
got some part of your question I'm not answering.
Female voice: Yes, but maybe you'll get there.
All right. But what is the part - what is the part of the question I'm not
talking about?
Another female voice: What she's - what she's trying to ask is, is that
when you get the - you have a preclear and then you ask him for his goals
list and he turns you in a list of goals, should you at that time (before
you begin eliminating them) ask him for further goals according to the
E-Meter, or could you just begin assessing them?
I see. The question got lost back in the beginning here. Yes. You don't
assess the list he gave you. Not until you've got a complete list. That is
the precise answer to it. Now I see the tension go off.
Preclear comes in, hands you a list of goals; yes, you add to that list.
You add all categories to that list. You do not look on his having handed
you a list of goals as having anything much to do with it. You're just
richer by having a few more goals that you didn't have to sweat for. It is
simply an assist. And you would - he'd take his list of goals, and then you
start in on SOP Goals search just as you would in any case.
You want goals in all shapes, varieties and categories. And you just go on
and on and on listing goals, goals, goals, goals, goals, and you list goals
until you've got a null needle.
Now, here's the mistake you're making. You are making a mistake. You're
asking for more goals, having nulled a lot of goals without running any
rudiments in between. And therefore, you are getting falls, falls, falls
that have nothing to do with more goals.
You are getting falls on "Oh, my God! Not any more goals. You mean, I have
to give him some more goals. Ohhhh." And you get a fall.
And then you immediately got the fall, and you say "Well, then obviously,
obviously the person has more goals, because he has a fall here." Oh,
that's not true.
Havingness. There are several things run the same way. You ask this
individual, "Do you have a present time problem?" It very often occurs this
way. You ask the person... This is true of meter. This is E-Metering. This
is a part of E-Metering.
You ask the person, "Do you have a present time problem?" and you get a
fall. Do you know that that can fall on having been asked for a present
time problem? He doesn't have a present time problem, but he's upset
because he thinks maybe he's going to have to spend the next two hours in
auditing, running one, and you already ran one yesterday fruitlessly, and
it didn't get anyplace. Or somebody has done something to him, and the
present time problem didn't get handled, so he thinks auditing will handle
it, and you're getting a fall, you see.
And here you are. You're getting a meter reaction on a present time
problem. The meter is never wrong. The meter is never, never, never, never
wrong, but you can sometimes ask the wrong question. See, you can ask the
wrong question, get a fall, and then get the wrong idea of why it's
falling. It's like this silly drill on, "Have you ever been a victim of
pain-drug-hypnosis?" you see. And of course, you get a fall, and so you
search it down and you find out that the cat PDHed him on the twelfth of
July at midnight, you see. And it all is idiotic. Well, the meter isn't
wrong. The meter isn't wrong. You just have asked a dull question.
The pc has a charge on "victim," has a charge on the word "pain," has a
charge on the word "drug," has a charge on the word "hypnosis" and drowned
a cat at twelve midnight - twelve July, midnight, see. Well, obviously, the
whole thing adds up all wrong and backwards. So you have to take your
questions apart, and you have to know what you're asking, and you have to
ask what you're asking to find - in such a way as to find out whether or
not you're - get a reaction on the sensibility of it or some odd side
effect.
So you say to this person, "Have you got any more goals?"
And the person says to himself, "Oh, no!" you know. And you get a fall.
And you say, "Oh, well, he's got more goals." "Well, what is this more
goals?"
And the person says, "Oh, no. I've thought of every goal I've ever had.
I've thought of a lot of goals I haven't ever had. I've tried to please
this auditor. I've tried and tried and tried to please this auditor. And
there's just no pleasing this auditor at all. And he hits me, so I'd better
create. The auditor hits me, so I'd better create some. So all right. Well,
let's see. Let's see, goals... What the hell is a goal?" you know.
And this is how your lists get so extended. It's because you're not
clearing what the meter is falling on.
So I'll give you a remedy for this. Run a rudiment before you ask for more
goals. Now that, of course, applies to your question too. Because, you see,
the person comes in; he's got a goals list. He thinks this is all the goals
he's ever had in his life. He hands you this list, and you promptly don't
go down the list and say, "Oh, well, that's it. That's it. Let's get the
show on the road." Instead of that, you ask him for more goals. Well, this
in itself is rather odd sometimes. It's not always invalidating, but
occasionally even that could be slightly invalidative to the pc, don't you
see, in some rather sensitive pc.
So here's what - here's what you should do. And here's what you would do
anyhow. You put him into Model Session in order to get more goals. You
don't just take off: He hands you the list; you start asking him questions.
That isn't the way you do it. You put him in Model Session. So you're in
effect running all the beginning rudiments between his having written the
goals list, you see, and your asking for more goals.
So, you get an opportunity to sort of clear this subject up because you've
got the rudiments, don't you see. And you can ask some burning questions
about goals while you're doing the rudiments. "How do you feel about goals?
How do you feel about people searching for goals on you? How do you feel
about giving up all these goals?" You can ask anything you want to like
this. And you start to get a fall on this sort of thing, clean it up. See?
You say, "Well, now how do you feel about - you did all these goals and
you've given them to me and so forth, and all right, and you realize I'm
going to ask you for even more goals than this. How would you feel about
that?"
You watch it. You'll see - sometimes you'll see a fall. And you'll say,
"Well now, what's the matter with that?" Well, you immediately believe that
he's got some goals he doesn't want to tell you about. No, he may be
falling from just the idea of exhaustion. See? So get this cleared up.
"Now, what's that fall? What's that fall for? What does that fall fall on?
More goals. What is that?"
"Oh, I don't know. Ah, yes. It's my father. He used to bang at me all the
time about what I was going to do in life." Or some poor girl - I've seen a
lot of girls practically spinning on this, trying to measure up to the
ambitions of their parents. Girls seem to get this more heavily than boys.
Boys get bored with it and run away. But the girl, she's sort of pinned
down, you see. And people come along and, "What are you going to do with
your life? What are you going to do with your life? What are you going to
be? What are you going to be, little boy? What are you going to be, little
girl? Are you going to be a fireman? Are you going to be this? Are you
going to be that? What are you going to be?" Of course - the schnucklehead
- he's being a little boy. He's perfectly all right.
I've seen parents do this on babies and absolutely drive babies halfway
around the bend. The kid is only six or seven months old, and yet he is
being hammered and pounded. Nothing he can do is pleasing. He's always got
to be able to do something else and something more. And they get it hot and
heavy, these little kids do. You know?
The kid actually learns to pick up a milk cup, you know? He thinks that's
pretty good. He's pretty smart, you know. And right away his parents want
him to pick it up with one hand, you know. So he learns to pick it up with
one hand, and so he learns to pick it up with one hand and drink it without
spilling any milk at all which is rather terrific, you know. Or even
actually be able to pick it up with one hand and splash it all over the
room, which is equally terrific.
And do the parents say anything at all about this? They say, "No, dear, you
must learn how to drink milk without or with splashing it all over the
room," you see. "You must learn to drink milk differently. You must learn
to drink milk differently." So he learns how to drink milk, and now he's
got to learn how to drink milk differently. See, here he is busy being a
little boy and they say, "Well, you better be a grown man," see. But he's
being a little boy, and nobody ever notices that he's being anything. All
they notice about him is an alter-is.
Well, this adds up on some pcs particularly to be an allergy, to get -
sometimes will get practically allergic to being asked for goals. "What are
you going to do in life, little boy," adds up to the auditor's, "Do you
have any more goals?" See, it's reactive.
So the smart thing for you to do before you ask for more goals is to run
end rudiments or something of that sort. Give him a little break there. Run
some end rudiments. Run some beginning rudiments. And now, before you
actually ask for the goals as actually part of the rudiments, you clear up
this subject of goals. "How do you feel about goals? Anybody ever pester
you about goals very much?" so forth.
And the person, "Oooooh, yeah." All right.
You get no reaction on the idea of the word "goals," see - no reaction on
this. Dandy. Dandy. Now let's say, "Have you got any more goals to add to
this list?"
And the pc will say, "No."
And you won't get a fall on the needle either. But the way you can continue
to get long, long lists and add to them forever, you see, is by mistaking
what your meter is reading. Your meter is reading on an allergy to giving
you any more goals, so you're reading it as though you've got now to get
more goals. You get the misinterpretation?
But this isn't as bad as it looks, this isn't as bad as it looks, because a
person who is having a rather hard time in life will give you five, six,
seven, eight, nine hundred, a thousand goals. But this at least saves you
from getting in the additional two hundred you wouldn't have gotten, you
see. I mean they just made up a couple of hundred there just to fill in
time or something like this. Something went wrong.
So before you ask for more goals, whether the pc just gave you the list and
you're just beginning or if you've just finished working over a whole
column of goals, for heaven's sakes, clear the subject of goals, asking for
goals and rudiments. And if you do that, you'll find your Goals Assessment
goes more rapidly. Okay? Sound wise to you? It is.
Well, that's more question than you asked, but I have had it on the back of
my mind for some time to speak to you about this. That okay?
Female voice: That's okay. Thank you.
All right. Wasn't any other part of that, was there?
Female voice: No. I've got it now.
You're sure?
Female voice: Yeah.
You're sure? All right. Any other question? Yes.
Another female voice: This follows right along and is equally - mine's
being - quite dumber. When you have been nulling them, you still have not
completed your list, do you keep on nulling at the beginning of the next
session or do you ever ask for more goals before you continue? Do you.
No. You just keep on nulling. And when you've totally run out of goals to
null - that is to say, you've just completed the list.
Female voice: Yes.
When you've gone through the list once, even though many goals remained
live, you ask for more goals. But the smart thing to do is to clear up
goals and run rudiments before you ask for more goals. Got it?
Okay. Any other questions? Yes?
Male voice: With Routine 1A, would you run one for one with the Security
Check?
Yeah. In Routine 1þ would you run one for one with the Security Check?
Yeah. But what do we mean by one for one? We simply mean if you're going to
spend six hours running Recall a Problem, then you're going to spend six
hours security checking and so on. You always bring a process up to a flat
point before you do something else, because you're in collision with the
Auditor's Code.
And you're going to find out this is pretty hard to do with Recall a
Problem, Routine 1A. Pretty hard to do, because you're not going to flatten
that very soon. And the guy can practically go on forever with a wobbling
tone arm and so forth.
The best way to run Routine 1A in an HGC, would be to take Routine 1A's
Problem Process and get that audited in formal session. And then take
another auditor or take another period of the day as an entire separate
activity and do a Security Check. And this supposes a unique problem. You
actually should flatten a process before doing something else or going on
to another thing or changing, you see.
Routine 1A - in its infancy right now - yet shows no great promise of
flattening rapidly. Certainly not flattening rapidly enough to do a
Security Check. And to follow the rule, well, flatten the process and then
do your Security Check, which you should do on the other routines... You
know, you shouldn't do the CCHs. You should bring CCH 4 up to a flat point
and then do a Security Check or something like that, you see. Or even CCH 2
up to a flat point and do your Security Check.
Well, you're dealing with one now in Routine 1A that doesn't have such flat
points - liable to go on forever. So you could get around this by setting
up an entirely different session, see, or atmosphere or period or
something. And just break it down so that we're running the pc at one time
of the day on problems, and running him another time of the day on Security
Checks.
You're going to find out Security Checks go more rapidly with Routine 1A
than they have been doing on CCHs. Routine 1A can be terribly slowed down
if the Security Check is omitted. And I would never go more than five hours
of Routine 1A's Problems Process without doing a Security Check. I know
that sounds like a rather involved answer, but I'm having to answer it on
my feet. This is a new routine. Okay? Right.
Female voice: On this point, you said in an HGC you could do this by having
two different auditors...
Yeah.
Female voice:. .. doing the job. Well, as a private auditor, could you, by
agreement with the preclear beforehand, set aside the morning for...
Uh-huh.
Female voice: ... auditing problems and the afternoon...
Right.
Female voice: ... for auditing checks.
Yeah. As a private auditor - HGC, you could give them a couple of different
auditors. A private auditor could probably most easily set aside a morning
session, just as you've said, and say we're going to run problems in the
morning and going to security check in the afternoon. Or we're going to run
Security Checks in the late afternoon; we're going to run problems in the
evening, or however we want to do. Or on alternate sessions, or something
like this, we're going to run one or the other.
This does pose a slight difficulty because Routine 1A can get awfully hot.
It can get awfully hot. And the pc will feel like you're tearing up the
whole universe around him. And havingness gets badly shot in Routine 1A,
apparently. And the apparency of the havingness shoot, of course, is the
fact that by taking off the confusions, you're knocking out the stable
datum which are havingness to the pc.
If the pc is looking on all these stable data as havingness, and these
havingnesses are disappearing because you're knocking the confusions off of
them, you've got the agitation and confusion of the problem agitating the
pc, and all problems are a "can't-have" anyhow. And then you've got the
stable data disappearing, and it looks rather - rather messy. And you've
got TR 10, which you can always run as part of Routine 1A. I personally
don't believe it is necessary, as long as your auditing is pretty smooth.
Auditing has to be pretty smooth to run 1A. You can't fool with a beefy
process like this with rough auditing.
But if an individual is apparently getting very agitated and running down
and that sort of thing, be assured that you are running the process which
also runs it out. You've got the pc up against all of his "can't-haves,"
almost simultaneously. So of course, he looks like a "can't-have," you see.
It's not really running down his havingness. But he has the feeling that it
is. And it makes him nervous and agitated and misemotional and so forth.
You'll run a lot of... This process runs pretty hot.
Now, if, however, this seemed to be too bad or something of the sort, you
always could find the pc's havingness process. Or you could use TR 10. I
mean, good auditing is good auditing. And as far as cutting off suddenly,
running problems - you know, the pc's got this terrible somatic. His head
is just half off, and it moved over to just here, see. And now you say,
"Well, that is the end of that process." Then you say, "Now we're going to
do a Security Check." I'm - I'm afraid you'd get a backfire.
So that's why this different sessions or different auditors running the
problem and the Security Check or a pre-agreed idea that at certain periods
we're going to security check and at certain periods we're going to run
problems. And you don't create the ARC breaks, you see. A pc isn't given
the sudden feeling like he's going to be left in what he has just been
plunged into, don't you see. He knows he'll have to face that up again
tomorrow, so it's all right. And he becomes content to do that.
You say, well, can't we do this in one session and give him understanding
in one session? Well, I personally doubt it. I personally doubt it because
you're - you're now violating, in the session... One session, you've got a
pre-understood situation going here, and the pc is not liable to examine
his contract while he's in session. So you better let him go out of session
and have him remember his contract, which his contract is, we're going to
do alternate sessions on problems and Security Checks. And he knows this.
This is easy to remember because it's two different parts of the day or
it's two different people. You've - I think you'll find on the whole, it's
a much happier situation.
Otherwise, you've got a big problem here. You got a big problem here with
problems. It is a problem with running it, and that is that it isn't going
to flatten fast. It's not a fast-flattening process.
I was very amused on an auditor's report last night to see somebody said -
they said, "Well, tomorrow or the next day when we get this flat, can we go
back to something or other?" and I thought, what hope. What hope. It - it
isn't going to happen that way, see. He's going to run this on here for
quite a little while, and it's just going to go and go and go and go and go
and go and go. It's a marvelous way to get all of the problems out of the
road that the pc's got so he isn't always coming up with PT problems. Your
future sessions are going to go rather easily. But to give this thing a
lick and a promise and leave it while it's in high restim would be a
dangerous thing to do, and in addition to that to hope that it's going to
flatten in the next session or so is not optimistic; it's foolish. It's not
going to.
It's just like the guy who'll sit there forever. You say, "Now, how does
that problem seem to you?" you know.
And the fellow says, "All right."
And you say, "All right. Now describe the problem to me. And the guy will
give you a different problem. Every time you'll get a different problem.
When you're running this, "How does it seem to you?" and "Describe the
problem." Well, it's, you know, the old - one of the earliest versions of
problems: "Describe the problem. How does it seem to you? All right. Good.
Describe the problem. How does it seem to you? Describe the problem. How
does it seem to you?" And if you've ever had any experience running that,
you know, he always gives you a different problem. He never gives you the
same problem.
And he comes into session and he says, "Well," he says, "my wife and I have
just had a quarrel, and she has just thrown the silver coffeepot down into
the areaway. And it was a gift from my grandmother who is about to die at
any moment. And this - our total future of economics is dependent on her
remembering us in the estate, and she's going to call this evening," you
see. It's a very involved problem.
And you say, "All right. Well, now that you described it, how does it seem
to you?"
"Oh," he says, "it's pretty grim."
You say, "Describe the problem to me."
"Well, the problem's not being able to work, you see, because I expect my
grandmother at all times, you see, to leave this estate."
You say what the hell happened to this coffeepot? You know, you've got a
coffeepot down in the middle of the areaway. Well, as far as that's
concerned, it'll stay in the middle of the areaway for the rest of the
session.
That's why we don't use, oddly enough, that is why we don't use any fancy
problems processes in rudiments. We don't give them any opportunity in
rudiments to do anything but run that problem they came up with. Now, the -
Change as a level in the Prehav Scale was developed to cure alter-is. And
it turns out that was a stopgap. Good as it was, it was a stopgap. What
cures alter-is is problems. And your pc that's obsessively alter-ising
anything, he'll run problems like a shot rocket. And problems is alter-is.
Because, of course - look at it - the guy has a problem, so he solves it.
Well, the solution to the problem is an alter-is of the problem, isn't it.
So you get this as being the modus operandi of alter-is. I've made this
discovery recently is why I suddenly am stressing and moved over onto 1A.
I've been trying to cure alter-is.
Here was the factor that stood in our road from time immemorial. The factor
that stood in our road was a very simple one. We gave the pc an auditing
command, and then he chewed it up and converted it into cellophane and
exported it to China, received Chinese taels for it, converted these into
rubles, went on an exploration to the North Pole and answered you with
blubber. And it might have sounded reasonable to the auditor most of the
time, but this tremendous chain of vias was going on. So you couldn't say
this process doesn't work on this pc, because the process had never been
administered to the pc. You know?
Now, there's ways to counteract that. You sit on top of a pc, practically
on his lap and breathing down his larynx, and you say to him every time,
"Now, exactly what did you do then?" or "What did you do with that auditing
command?" It's very good practice every now and then to ask a pc, "How did
you do that one?" You know? And he'll give you... And you will sometimes
get the wildest concatenation of transferring taels to blubber,
transferring it this way and that way. And then it goes out to a little
spot that is eight feet off of the head, and then this spot plays a small
tune. And then he knows because his toe is getting warm that the proper
answer is... And it'll be some wild via-via-via-via-via, you see.
Well, now, you're running into this so strongly, so strongly, continuously,
in running problems that you have to check up on this often, only it isn't
"How did you do it?" that you check up on; it's "Did you do it?" You ask
him for the problem he just recalled. Now you're going to be amazed if you
haven't been already, the number of times the person really hasn't recalled
a problem. Have you noticed that? Have you? They haven't really recalled a
problem. They've just gotten the foggy notion of all of the confusion, see.
All right. So here's this fellow in a foggy confusion of some kind or
another with about three somatics, and you all of a sudden say, "We're
going to security check you." Now, I tell you, that's wonderful productive
of ARC breaks. I don't care what understanding you've got, what contract
you've got written and how many witnesses you had when you signed it with
the pc, it isn't going to hold. Not even if you took it to court would it
hold on some pcs. Say, "Oh! No wait! What do you mean - what do you mean
Security Check? What? Are you kidding? My head's - oh! and so on. It's a
terrible pain here, and so on. And there's something going on - and you
want to security check me. Oh, you're not taking care of me, auditor," see.
So he goes right out of session. So you'd have to do it on different
sessions or with different people if you're going to run Security Checks
before Problems shows any signs of flattening.
I sight trouble up the line with this, that's why I'm stressing it so hard.
Okay? All right. I over-answered that one, but I hope that's all right.
Okay?
All right. Yes?
Male voice: What's the matter with overcoming the problem of the preclear
not actually getting out an answer by having him verbally answer each
command?
Yeah. Well, of course, that's time-consuming. Spot-checking was an early
auditor mechanism to keep the pc in communication without wasting all of
the time. Now, as you know, you've run a lot of pcs who are extremely
verbose.
Male voice: Yeah, including me.
Yeah. 'Well, you give them - you give them an auditing command and you ask
them to answer it aloud. You, by the way, would never give an understanding
you were going to answer all these auditing commands aloud. There isn't
anything like that. You'd have to tell him every time to tell you what it
was all about, and by the time you've wasted four or five session hours out
of an intensive just because he was stumbling around on this you'll say,
well, this pc would have gotten further if he'd simply recalled it.
So that you're doing a police check really. You're doing a spot check, and
that's all you want. That's all you want. You don't want every question
policed, you see. But you want it random enough so that it takes them by
surprise and keeps them disciplined. Every few commands, particularly if
the pc looks a little bit wuuhh, you know, it's a very good thing to say,
"Now what was that problem?"
"Oh, oh, what was the problem! I don't uh - what problem?" so on.
And it's about time you said, "I'll repeat the auditing command. Recall a
problem."
"Ohhh. Recall a problem. That's what you want."
"I'll repeat the auditing command. Recall... "
Say, by the way, I wonder if I've mentioned to you, every time the pc says
anything or repeats the auditing command after you, or makes any comment of
any kind on the auditing command - not cognition - you say, "I'll repeat
the auditing command" and do so. Do you do that routinely?
Audience: Yes.
Well, don't drop that one out of your works, because the pc very often
feels he has answered the auditing command.
You say, "Recall a problem," and he says "Cheesecake." And, you know? Chee
- hm - you know. He'll nod. "Recall a problem" - nod, you know. What's
happened? He's said to himself "Cheesecake," you know. And well, that's all
right. He'll look vague, and then you could check up on it. That's one part
of this.
But the other part of this is more important. You say "Recall a problem."
And the person says, "I never knew oak trees grew that large."
You say, "I'll repeat the auditing command," see. "Recall a problem."
"Oh, oh, oh, oh, yes, yes. Ah-ha, yeah. Yeah. I missed that for a minute."
You say, "Good. I'll repeat the auditing command. Recall a problem."
And the pc says, "Yes." He did, see. He gets a feeling that he's answered
the auditing command. You can actually get into a silly situation where you
think the pc is comm lagging, when as an actual fact, he thinks he's
answered the auditing command. And when a pc repeats the auditing command
after you, you've got a circuit in bloom. And if you don't repeat the
auditing command, he is being audited by his circuit.
So the rule is, when the pc says anything after you've said the auditing
command, which isn't an answer to the auditing command, you say "I'll
repeat the auditing command," and do so. But there are two versions here of
this.
Cognition (which is an internal comment of some kind or another or a
realization; a cognition is a realization): If the words repeating - "I'll
repeat the auditing command" - would tend or look like they were an
invalidation of his cognition, you don't use them. You just repeat the
auditing command. You got the idea? If you're very good at this and your
intentions are very good at this, there's no confusion in his mind that it
is a different auditing command. He knows it's the same auditing command.
You see how that works? But don't take a chance. There's two sides of this:
(1) You can be so pedantically insistent on repeating the auditing command,
the pc feels he can't communicate with you. And there's Clause 16,
Auditor's Code, out. You can very easily shut off a pc's communication with
this "I'll repeat the auditing command." Let's take the other side of this
picture, however, and have the pc saying things and commenting on things
and then have him sink back. Well, he must have kept that in some circuitry
or some sort to keep the auditing command alive, don't you see. So you have
to say the auditing command again. So you have to be clever enough to
acknowledge what he said - acknowledge what he said - without ending the
cycle of action. It's a semi-acknowledgment, by the way. These are half
acknowledgments, and you acknowledge what he said without ending the cycle
of the auditing command, and then you say the auditing command, see.
You say, "Mm-hm. All right. Recall a problem." See? You say to him, "Recall
a problem."
And he says, "Gee! I haven't - haven't thought of that - I haven't thought
of that for a long, long, long, long time," and so forth.
Well, in that case, you're not quite sure, so you'd say, "Did you recall a
problem?"
"Oh," the person says, "No. No. As a matter of fact, I - I didn't."
"All right. Recall a problem." See?
If you put a little insistence on your auditing command, it doesn't sound
like a new auditing command. It sounds like a repeat.
You get how this is? It's an interestingly narrow border. Now you say,
"Recall a problem." New command. "Recall a problem."
And the pc says, "Gee, it's getting late, isn't it?" And you say, "Mm-hm.
Recall a problem."
"Oh, oh-ho, oh, you want me to recall a problem, yeah." "Recall a problem."
"Well, I - I don't know. I'm all confused about it," and so forth.
And you say, "I'll repeat the auditing command. Recall a problem."
He isn't under any illusion but that is the same auditing command that you
are repeating over and over, don't you see? If you get good at this, you
can actually drop out a lot of this "I'll repeat the auditing commands." If
you're good at this.
There is such a thing as half acknowledgment, and there is such a thing as
actually repeating the auditing command in such a way that there is no
margin of doubt anywhere. He knows it's a repeat of the same command that
you just gave him. Okay?
Audience: Yes. Mm-hm.
Right. Always get the auditing command you asked answered, by the way.
Always get that answered, otherwise your pc goes out of session. Yes.
Male voice: Ron, could you ask the pc, "Do you still have the auditing
command?"
Yeah, you can. But you would ordinarily ask that while he was comm lagging
and drifting around. It'd be almost an emergency situation. Its use would
be very rare. Very rare. It's usually a very bad thing to interrupt a comm
lag of the pc. The pc is, you know, looking for this. He's looking for it,
he's looking for it, he's looking for it, looking for it. And all of a
sudden, the auditor distracts him.
The most basic source of ARC breaks with auditors which are legitimate ARC
breaks, is the auditor taking attention - the pc's attention off of his own
case and putting it on the auditor. You'll find out that statement right
there is the common denominator of ARC breaks. In other words, the pc is -
got his attention on his case, and the auditor does something to pull his
attention off. And that just about will practically finish some pcs. What
happens is you get a sudden change of attention. And change of attention is
associated in all minds with accidents, pain, casualties and so forth, you
see. The fellow was standing there minding his own business, and all of a
sudden this sixteen-inch shell hit him in the back, see.
Well, that's a sudden change of attention. And if the auditor yanks the
pc's attention off his bank and puts it on the auditor, what the auditor's
trying to do or say, then - in the case of an auditor flub, or in the case
of an auditor intruding during a comm lag, or in some other case of -
analogous - then the pc gets the sensation of having been hurt or struck.
And you have to be kind of careful about this, so that if the pc is sitting
there, and you're saying by this time, "Well, good God! Eight, nine, ten
minutes have gone by. He sure can't still be thinking of the auditing
command," you know. I'd wait till he sort of looked up for a moment dazedly
in my direction. I would say to him - not very specific or not very
intrusive - "You still got that?"
He'd say, "What?"
You say, "All right. I'll repeat the auditing command."
"Oh, well, yeah. I was drifting off..." And you don't get an ARC break. But
the pc is deeply interiorized, and he's thinking, he's thinking. He's
running through his mind and through his mind. He hasn't said a thing. He's
still got the auditing command. He's doing what he's supposed to be doing.
He is the soul of purity and goodness. He's doing everything you said. He
is in control. He's interested in his own case. He'll give you the answer
as soon as he's got one.
And you stick your number 10's in and you say, "Have you still got the
auditing command?"
And he says to himself, "My God, I give up. Here I am doing everything I'm
supposed to be doing," you got the idea, "and here you have given me a
sudden shift of attention." And then you'll get the blowups and there's
your fruitful source of ARC breaks. Okay?
Male voice: Yes, thank you.
All right. You bet.
Female voice: Um, should the preclear ask you to repeat the auditing
command or say he's lost the auditing command, is it necessary to say, "I
will repeat the auditing command" before you repeat it to him? - should he
ask you for it.
Oh, I very often omit it. If you say - the pc thinks he's lost the auditing
command and he asks the auditor to repeat the auditing command, does the
auditor then say, "I will now repeat the auditing command," and do so? Yes,
this is formally, exactly, absolutely correct. That's absolutely correct.
It can, however, be omitted as a preliminary statement to repeating it. The
pc says, "I haven't got that command. What did you say?" And just simply
say, "Well, recall a problem." He won't take it amiss. You bet.
Female voice: Is there any way that you can tell on the E-Meter what the pc
is doing, if he still has the command or if he doesn't?
Yeah. Yeah. It'll wander around. Needle - needle will wander around. Tone
arm will move. If these things all of a sudden become still and there's
nothing happening on the meter at all, it's almost legitimate to assume
that he has lost the auditing command or is thinking about something else
or is doing something else. You can tell on a meter if you watch the meter
whether the pc still has the auditing command and is still doing it.
If the pc is still doing the auditing command, of course, he's plowing
through energy masses of one character or another, and this is the first
thing that the E-Meter registers. So of course, it does register whether or
not he still has the auditing command. I would not say it was totally
vital, because I think a pc could give himself an auditing command and give
himself some other auditing command, and you'd still get a meter reaction.
This isn't a foolproof answer, but it is an answer. Okay?
Female voice: Thank you.
All right.
Another female voice: You mentioned that in running Routine 1A, the
preclear may need havingness or he may look as though he needs it, but not
really need it.
Mm-hm.
Female voice: Well, you can... Could you just check that up with a
hand-squeeze test? I assume you can.
The pc may look like he needs havingness or may actually need havingness.
It goes like this: It's how gaunt and wan does this pc start looking. It's
a question of degree. You will find in running Recall a Problem, that the
havingness will drop and then resurge. You know, goes down and then he
comes up and he's all right.
All right. Supposing it just kept going down, and he just kept getting
hollow-eyed and he's deeper and deeper and further and further gone over a
period of a half an hour or something like this, and the bottom had
practically dropped out. Well, I'd bring it up to a point that wasn't
disturbing anything, you know, where he had a couple or three answers that
were fairly close together, and I'd run some havingness on him. It's a
question of degree. It's a question of how bad off does this pc look. But
he can look pretty bad, by the way, without going by the boards. He can
look pretty bad without going by the boards.
Female voice: Would the hand-squeeze test not be valid in that situation?
Perfectly valid. Hand-squeeze test would be perfectly valid. But you start
running in and out of problems, you're going to get stuck needles, loose
needles, stuck needles, loose needles, stuck needles, loose needles. And
the fact that a needle is stuck up for a moment or two would not be a
criterion that he needed havingness.
You'd run havingness the same way as you always ran it. We could run the
Havingness and Confront Process over into Routine 1A as far as that's
concerned. I mean, you don't have to worry about that. May do so. Perfectly
legitimate. Havingness and Confront Process are not an integral part of
Routine 2. They've just been stuck in Routine 2 because we didn't have any
other stowage for them. Okay?
All right. Yes.
Male voice: Would Routine 1A flatten a hidden standard?
Would Routine 1A flatten a hidden standard? It sure would. That's a very
good thing you asked that, Robin, because frankly that's what it's looking
for. The alter-is and the hidden standards - if you can get these things
out of the way, man, you can clear them with a swish. And if you - if
they've still got hidden standards, even while you're doing Goals
Assessments, their hidden standards can remain a little too effective. It
certainly gets the hidden standard out of the road. And if you've got the
alter-is out of the road, the obsessive change of the auditing command so
that you can give him auditing commands (which is what the CCHs are for) -
and if you can get the hidden standards out of the road, voilÞ! You really
got it made. Answer your question?
Male voice: Thank you.
All right. Yes.
Female voice: What if you - in running 1A, you have a preclear who
volunteers oral answers? Do you tell him to shut up?
In running Routine 1A, what if you have a preclear that volunteers oral
answers. Such as what? Now, give me an example.
Female voice: Well, such as for me - it is being run on me - and I have -
each time the command has been asked, I have given the preclear a verbal
answer. I mean, the - the auditor a verbal answer.
Ah, yeah. Go on.
Female voice: Well, this has been going on for several sessions. Should I
quit doing it?
Oh, no...
Female voice: You know, it's the natural way of doing it.
.       no, no, no, no, no, no.
Female voice: And I was wondering, if - when I was an auditor, if it should
be prohibited.
No, no, no, no, no. You see, let's get back to the definition of an
auditing command. It goes back to this fundamental: An auditing command
when executed has had performed exactly what it said, and nothing else. An
auditing command has no understoods about it. There's no prearrangement
about an auditing command except maybe learning the language.
So if you have said "Tell me - Recall and tell me about a problem," then,
of course, you would expect him to do it always. If you have said "Recall
but don't tell me about a problem," you would expect him to recall one but
not say a word to you - neither one of which are workable commands. I'm
just giving you - they'd have to be that. And that is the only way you
would be able, by the Auditor's Code and all standards of auditing, to
regulate whether the pc talked or not. It'd have to be inherent in the
auditing command.
Now, when you've said, "Recall a problem," you haven't told him to do
anything but recall a problem. Now, he has recalled a problem, and if he
then elects to tell you about it, all right. If he elects not to tell you
about it, all right. That is not part of the auditing command. So you can't
have a prearranged agreement with the pc in any event as to anything he was
going to do. You got the idea?
Female voice: Yes.
If you understand that very carefully, you never get in trouble with a pc.
Remember that it's very difficult to get into trouble as a pc being audited
by any auditor if you only do what the auditor says. This is quite
interesting. Never do anything else than what the auditor says. Only do
what the auditor says. This is an interesting index. It's very difficult
for you to get into trouble.
I had an auditor finally get past that one, one time by simply changing the
command before it could be answered, several times. And that you couldn't
do anything about, see. Gave you one process then gave you another process
and another process, and each time waited for no answer and said, "Oh, no,"
or something like this, and then gave you another one. And then finally
says, "Well, answer the auditing command." And I had to say, "Which
auditing command?" And the auditor practically blew up.
Well, I had to know. I mean, I didn't even have any understanding about
whether - whether you answered the first command first or the last command
first or what command did you ask first. And I had four auditing commands,
and they had all been asked, but no answer had been waited for on any of
the auditing commands. Coo! Where did we go? What did we do? So that point
of confusion can - could happen, but... Or the auditor who just won't give
any auditing commands, who just sits there silent. Best cure for that, of
course, is go in the other room and get a gun and shoot them, put them out
of their misery.
But that is - those are the two wild tricks that can be played by a person
who is pretending to audit. It'd only be a pretense of auditing, but those
are the two wild tricks, is not give any commands - just remain silent - or
give a whole series of different commands without wanting any answer to any
of the commands. And between those two things, you'd have about all that
you really could do wrong in auditing.
Give auditing commands that can't be answered. Don't let them be answered.
Don't wait for them to be answered. Give other commands before those
commands can be answered, preferably different commands on a different
process; or say nothing. That is the most maddening thing to a pc, is the
pc gets a horrible somatic and waits for the next auditing command, and
there is none. Fifteen minutes go by, and there is no next auditing
command. The auditor is just sitting there. Can you imagine that condition
occurring? Well, I have seen the condition occur a few times. Quite
amazing.
What happened to the auditor? Where is the auditor? Why - and wha - . Its a
question of the auditor went totally out of session. You know, he's not
supposed to be in-session, so he's gone out of session, what do you do
about it, you see? There isn't anything you can do about it.
Beyond those two things, you're always perfectly safe to do exactly what
the auditor says. And oddly enough, you sometimes make a monkey out of some
auditors when you do exactly what the auditor says and you do nothing but
what the auditor says. The oddities of some auditing commands suddenly come
to view. I can't think of an example readily on the thing, but you will run
into them from time to time. You do exactly what the auditor said, and - he
didn't tell you to do that. Oh, yes, he did. He said - distinctly, he said,
"Think of a time when you weren't answering an auditing command."
And he says, "Well? Well?"
And you say, "I am."
"Well," he says, "when, when?"
"Well, right now. I'm not answering an auditing command."
And he'll say, "By golly, that's right. Well, let's see, I'd better phrase
this auditing command so that it can be done."
That little game I used to play. I always used to do the exact auditing
command that I was given. They're pretty wild. You listen sometime when
you've seen somebody, particularly making up commands of some kind or
another.
If a command is unanswerable when I'm being audited, I just simply say so.
But this is not even an advice or a discipline to a pc. You cannot give
advice to a pc. That's an evaluation. That's telling the pc how to act. You
mustn't ever tell the pc how to do the auditing command in addition to the
auditing command. It was - all must be inherent in the auditing command you
expect to be answered. And that's the only direction the pc has.
If the pc is doing something else, well, you better rephrase the auditing
command if you don't want him to do it. Because if by the standards of the
auditing command he could do this thing, that would be very incorrect in
auditing to censure him for doing it. You got it? That comes under the
shuns. I'm covering that rather heavily because it's one of the great
fundamentals of auditing. It was thoroughly disregarded in most
psychotherapy that has ever been practiced. It just has never been a factor
that has ever come up.
They talk about all sorts of things. They evaluate and they invalidate, and
they never let the patient give an answer. They don't ever expect the
patient to answer all these various things. I hope that answered your
question.
Female voice: Yes.
You should just go on answering. Your specific answer is whatever the
auditor asks, you do it if it can be done. And if it can't be done, tell
him so.
Female voice: You do it the way - as a preclear, then, you do it the way
you would do it.
Yes. You just always do it the way you do it.
Female voice: And as an auditor, you don't ask him to do it any different
than he would do it.
That's for sure. If you want him to do it some other different way than
what he's doing it, you'd better add it to the auditing command.
Female voice: Now I understand.
Yeah. So you'd have no understanding going on it. It would simply be a
statement. You know, it wouldn't be from - we clear at the beginning of
session that each time he answers the auditing question, he's going to put
both feet flat on the floor. All right. That's valid for one answer - just
one answer - because it's sort of part of the first auditing command, you
see.
You say, "Well, now every time I ask you an auditing command - every time I
ask you an auditing command, which is going to be one - you put both feet
flat on the floor. All right. Now, here is the auditing command. When was
George born?"
And you put both feet flat on the floor, and you say, "October the 2nd,
1716, or something."
And you cross your legs. And he says, "All right. When was George born?"
And you say, "October the 2nd, 17 - ."
He says, "Wait a minute. You didn't put both your feet on the leg - on the
floor."
And you say, "Well, you didn't tell me to either."
"Let's see. Let's see. That's right. I didn't," you know.
There are no understoods. No carry-overs.
You'll sometimes see one of these things in as a sleeper. You won't notice
it, but it's a sleeper. It's a sleeper in a session. And it's actually
interrupting the session. You've got some understanding that you're going
to quit at 4:15. That's an integral part of every auditing command. See?
You can very often introduce these weird things. The auditor makes a
contract with the pc, or the pc makes a contract with the auditor that it's
going to be so and so and so and so. Well, of course, that's good for the
first auditing command. That's all.
There is no contract between the auditor and the pc from the pc's
viewpoint. There is a contract from the auditor's viewpoint. The auditor is
there to give him some auditing for a certain period of time, but even the
period of time disappears as far as the pc is concerned. There isn't
anything else. There is nothing but the auditing command. That is all. And
then there's this acknowledgment and the various guidance that he gets from
the auditor. That's it. When it is givn