Subject: Re: Fishman > My Reply to a letter from David Mayo From: David Mayo Date: 1996/05/02 Message-Id: <4m9k5p$7g1@light.lightlink.com> Sender: electra@light.lightlink.com Organization: Art Matrix - Lightlink Electra Gateway v2.4 Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology,alt.clearing.technology -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- On 3/14/96 you posted to a.r.s and a.c.t under this header: "Fishman > My Reply to a letter from David Mayo" (Note that you were replying to a letter, not a post.) 1. I had emailed you a private letter (which I did not save). In that letter I had pointed out that some of the information you were posting was incorrect. That is the only email letter that I have ever sent you. I sent it to you as a courtesy, to warn you that you were posting inaccurate information, and that I intended to expose RTC's similar false statements and misuse of Flo's unfortunate death. Instead of replying to that email, you posted an edited version of my email and your reply. You did not email me a copy of your post. 2. At the time when your posted this I was in Los Angeles handling legal matters related to one of our Scientology(tm) lawsuits. I saw your post some time later. As I was still not ready to expose the RTC/OSA misconduct regarding Flo's death, I did not post anything further nor did I email you again as I no longer trusted you not to post that also (or an edited version thereof). 3. The only prior action that I had related to you was when Margaret Dellerson, private investigator working for Scientology(tm) was bothering you and you were trying to find information about her, I posted to a.r.s a declaration by her filed in the COST case against us which showed both a) that she had worked for Scientology(tm) before and b) her PI license number. Your 3/14/96 post of my letter with your comments and my responses follows: xenu@ix.netcom.com(STEVEN FISHMAN ) wrote: >David Mayo@lightlink.com wrote On 3 Mar 1996 19:58:46 GMT: >>Fishman wrote> >>>Dear alt.religion.scientology, >>> >>>David Miscavige is the self-proclaimed "ecclesiastical" head of the >>>cult. >>[...] >>>His mother-in-law, Flo Barnett supposedly killed herself in 1985: >>[...] >>>Or maybe Miscavige wanted her dead. After all, it didn't make Mr. >>>Ecclesiastic very happy when he found out that his mother-in-law had >>>been receiving auditing from his arch enemy David Mayo, a squirrel Me: Flo Barnett was not receiving auditing from me at that time and I have never audited Flo Barnett at any other time. From your other post, you might try to twist this to say that you meant my wife had audited Flo, which is well known. That is not the same thing and also not related to her death. >(the >>>super squirrel who wrote solo NUTs). >> >Mayo: >>The above is not true. Nor were your earlier statements to the effect >>that Flo Barnett committed suicide while was receiving services at the >>AAC or doing NOTs at the AAC or under me. Those are false data >>generated by and used by RTC in a disgusting and discreditable >>attempt to discredit me in court and to cover up their own "handlings" >>of her that were on going prior to and during that period. >> >>I hope to expose RTC for those lies and other malicious conduct. Me: I still hope to do so but that may no longer be possible or may no longer be as effective due to Steve Fishman alerting RTC by posting this. >> >>If you want to criticize me that is your right but be accurate. Me: My statement above is still true as to my defence of your right (or anyone else's) to criticize me AND as to my advice that you be accurate. I object to libel and defamation whether it comes from you or from RTC. I will post full information about Flo Barnett, her relationship with the AAC, myself, my wife, Joyce (whom I do not think is lying) and the RTC "handlings" that were done on Flo, etc., in a later post. >> >>David >Dear David, >I was told about the events leading up to Flo's death by my friend >Joyce Stephenson, who was also one of Flo's best friends. Joyce >mentioned that Flo said to her that she had been audited by you. Me: I do not believe that Joyce made that statement. I think you have misreported Joyce's statement. I have not had any contact with Joyce in many years but I do not believe she would have said that. >If you say it is not the case, then I will indicate so and retract it >on a.r.s. Your statement of fact undoubtedly carries more weight >evidentiarily than hearsay. Me: I do not want nor am I seeking your indication or retraction on a.r.s. >However, my point is that Joyce claimed Flo told her she had seen you >for auditing. My only question is, "Why would Flo have told her that >or made it up if it was not true?" What motive did she have for lying? >Did Flo ever ask you to audit her, and did you refuse to give her any >services? She is dead 11 years, but the complicity of Miscavige in her >death is an issue which is very much alive, and with all personal >feelings aside, any light you can shed on this will enable her not to >have died in vain. I will answer these in a separate post. In the meantime, I do not believe that either Joyce (or Flo) were lying. Furthermore, although Flo had almost no money left after having done all her "bridge" in Scientology(tm) I did not "refuse to give her services" at the AAC and in fact I directed that she was welcome to come any time with no payment or donation expected. >I can understand how RTC would want to blame you for what happened to >her, and I applaud your efforts to expose them. All I care about is >knowing the truth and what really happened. Do you care about the truth or do you only want to discredit NOTs ? In my opinion, one of the main reasons why Scientology(tm) committed illegal acts and anti-social acts was because of an "ends justify the means" belief, compounded by the idea that what they were doing was so important that any incidental harm or wrong doing did not matter. >David, there is no secret that I have no lost love for the Tech. I >believe it causes paranoid and delusional thinking, and I have said so >openly. I believe Flo would be alive if she didn't think she was being >violently attacked by Body Thetans. Joyce has repeated over and over >that Flo believed in the Tech; she believed that it worked; and Joyce >even admonished me for making statements to the contrary. For example, >I once thought that Flo killed herself because she thought the Tech >didn't work, and had failed her. But Joyce strongly disagrees. Flo >steadfastly believed in the Tech. Scientology never takes >responsibility for anything; it is always the PC's fault. So I have >come to accept the premise that Flo blamed herself, and if in fact she >did kill herself and was not murdered, then she ended her life because >she was depressed, thinking that she was misapplying the Tech and not >doing something right. These are your opinions. >Another question I have in this endless investigation, is whether Flo >Barnett ever planned to sue Miscavige. That was something else that I >heard; but if she believed in the Tech, then she would have had no >reason or motive to sue him. And so, if she was not intent on suing >the Church, what motive did the Church have for killing her? Could it >be possible that she was a "loose cannon", a potential source of >embarrassment for Miscavige? Or, did she in fact kill herself, like >the coroner concluded? >Even if Flo Barnett killed herself, the factors that drove her to do it >originate from the damage caused to her by auditing the OT levels. Any >reasonable person can see that. Your opinions, which are not based on fact and no reasonable person would think so. >With regard to you, my intention was never to discredit you personally. >I respect you for getting out when you did and coming forward to defend >and protect what you created, and to prevent Hubbard from stealing your >ideas. That is not the point and is not what I am trying to accomplish. >I think you can agree with my viewpoint that on one hand I admire you >for your courage in going against the cult with its battery of lawyers, >and on the other hand I can disagree with you for having written >processes which I know to be psychologically harmful and dangerous. >When I referred to you as a "squirrel", well, that obviously goes with >the territory --- Scientology will always see you in that light. I >myself wrote an autobiography entitled the "Lonesome Squirrel", because >in the hei >ght of my exposure to mind control, I had believed myself to be the >biological father of Christ, which was evaluated for me by my auditors >until I accepted it unquestioningly. At one point, I wrote a book >called "The Hol >y Book of Life" by Malchoot the Antichrist, because I was overly >frustrated with Scientology not moving fast enough to de-Christianize >the planet and FSM all of the Christians into Scientology. Your orientation has changed. >It is for these reasons --- my nearly committing suicide, that I find >the "Tech" so morally repugnant and dangerous. I do not discriminate >against whose Tech I criticize, whether it be yours or Hubbards. I >don't think solo NOTs is any more healthy than any other part of the >Advanced Technology. >So, if Flo Barnett did NOT receive auditing from you, this is very >important, and I will post it on a.r.s., since it is even more >compelling as she was mishandled by her auditors at the Church. >Furthermore, Miscavige's effort to condemn and blame you the >mishandlings is far worse --- and further proof of his criminal >intentions. >I wanted to clear the air (no pun intended) and state on the record >before a.r.s. exactly how I feel about the entire situation, since >apparently you felt that I was sending out mixed signals. This is >entirely justifiable, since as I said earlier, I really do respect and >admire your courage in fighting back. >However, my position on the Tech is very specific: I believe it is >extremely harmful and can under specific circumstances lead to suicide. >I think both of us have passed the point where we can talk about these >issues without it ever getting personal. >After all, neither one of us works for the Guardian's Office or OSA >anymore. I never did. >With Best Wishes, >Steve Fishman David Mayo -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMYhRp+mCyCdNXuVZAQGxbwP7Bes37taa6u/7w0KrZwxC4oRJVoqj7bxm SLnrBjMsyNzMIBUhO9ScdlpmyY/AnH7EeA+U/rXSEEDx5o6N5wV5s3aNva5PFgFT 9FW0VZ+32FV8vW9tUnz7BuVGr26LjRW0F5jP/hHmTMfm3wXbYugqv65SiWzcdpGD G54ZMHfXUaM= =S8q9 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----